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  #1  
Old 12-24-2015, 12:27 AM
Asmodians
  • Rank: General
  • Posts: 241
Default PVP Help vs Well-geared Arena of Disc

I am frustrated losing in arena of discipline today and it's always the same scenario that I cannot seem to do anything differenty in. I'm 4-star and full officer geared with it +7/8 and almost full accessories (no belt and last earring) and have my vision stigma build. Any time I face a glad, temp, ranger, or sin, they proc silence godstone at nearly every time they come in range.

First, I'm tired of the boar that silences you for 10-12 sec. Who the NYERK added that to the game? It's a LOSE if you are cloth and that gets applied (especially if multiple times in that stage) and not nearly as debilitating for other classes due to noncasters auto attack still doing significant damage. The thing spawns out of nowhere and you can't get away from it fast enough most times even if you are aware of it.

Vs ranger: virtually no cooldowns, and sorc cooldowns are long. I can't survive the sleep arrow, double trap silence knockback/stun burst...repeatedly that they can always pull when things aren't going their way. Sleep arrow lasts longer than any of our sleeps even if they land after the arrow lands. Ranger has to be bad not to win. Not a fair fight for sorc, give the ranger a silence godstone or para godstone may as well afk and throw the keyboard.

vs epic glads: cleave/force cleave/great cleave, extendable, silence godstone, the thing knocks you down from afar and silences you and they take 80% of my hp before I can even get a 1 sec somnolence off. They have strengthen wings and unwavering devotion for snare/stun immunity, and I can't sleep them fast enough before I'm knocked down sometimes. I use illusion to get off a sleep sometimes, but then my opener isn't strong enough to kill them (and I socket everything mboost/hp) before they close the distance and kill. Nearly all melee at my level are running from wintry armor or jumping outside of it with their extendable (and more cleaves, 18 sec cd). I practice against glad friends in game and none of them hit like these glads.

vs epic templars: similar to glads. killed in a few shots, and it takes me multiple rotations to whittle them down only for them to get full heals and repeat when I'm on cooldowns.

vs epic chanters: multiple remove shocks, cast speed debuff, knocked down the whole time from range, oh and this class lands silence godstone more than ANY others. Then they just run around the corner until time runs out. Chanters used to be the easiest class for sorcs to kill back in 2.x and now I can't kill them easily at all.

vs SW: pretty easy except the ones that get off the staggered rest combo from danceoff--> freestyle.

vs SM: even yet tough match, usually can win; easily win if socket curse of weakness.

vs other sorcs: toss up of who wins more cc battles and has better ping. Lost to Emperor and Lightwing(s), both who out cc me somehow. Emperor has better ping clearly due to the 2 sec somn to my 1 sec one. Perhaps he has Aion's chosen title?

vs sins: even match of who can kill the other first, barring the sin lands silence godstone repeatedly or wins early and then just hides the rest of the game. This isn't fair at all.

vs aethertech: not sure, haven't fought enough...win some lose some
vs gunslingers: similar to sin/ranger. I do better against these than rangers tho.

vs clerics: easy, don't see them at my ranking. MR ones lose due to 4.8 buffs. damage ones are not sorcs and easier to kill than sorcs.

Any tips? Mostly looking for help against the glad, ranger, and chanter. Bonus for vs gunner/AT or other sorcs.

Last edited by Jalapeno - Israphel; 12-24-2015 at 12:32 AM.
  #2  
Old 12-24-2015, 06:00 AM
Asmodians
  • Rank: General
  • Posts: 257
Default Re: PVP Help vs Well-geared Arena of Disc

Post what rotation you are trying to use?
From my experience Sorcs kill things faster than most classes...
When I play my sin sorcs always use that annoying reflect of 1300 per hit giving them time to use their toolkit of silence, sleep, balaur seeker, glacial shard etc etc. I have seen sorcs use like 2 skills and kill fully geared people?
Can experienced Sorc pipe in here? The silence is annoying but gotta use your potions at the right time. Multiple silences well its happened to all of us.
  #3  
Old 12-24-2015, 07:09 AM
Elyos
  • Rank: King Fat
  • Posts: 2,543
Default Re: PVP Help vs Well-geared Arena of Disc

I cannot speak for the other classes, but I've played chanter religiously for almost 4 years nonstop. I can give you a little insight as to what goes through my mind when I fight sorcs.

I anticipate the sleep. It's going to happen so I do everything to KD, stun, or silence you before it happens. If that fails and sleep lands I proceed to watch your debuffs closely. BME and Delayed is free damage so I can't do anything against that. What I will do is dispell your debuffs as you apply them on me. When you use Ice Chain, I'll teleport that off and take the damage from Frozen Shock. By this time, I may have Flame Cage on me and you may decide to silence with the silence being the 4th or 5th debuff.

Once I pot the silence, I'm going to KD you in the middle of your nukes, possibly silence you, and do as much damage to you as I can until one of us dies. A small note though, chanters can only do the above actions once simply because our ability to pot the silence is only as good as our ability to teleport off movement related debuffs.

Most chanters are able to do this successfully in a good magic suppression set. I personally don't use MS as 1250-1300 attack/1100 crit/2100 MA on a chanter with an apesh*t playstyle is enough to put a sorc on the defensive.
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  #4  
Old 12-24-2015, 03:36 PM
Asmodians
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Default Re: PVP Help vs Well-geared Arena of Disc

Quote:
Originally Posted by Malekith - Tiamat View Post
Post what rotation you are trying to use?
From my experience Sorcs kill things faster than most classes...
When I play my sin sorcs always use that annoying reflect of 1300 per hit giving them time to use their toolkit of silence, sleep, balaur seeker, glacial shard etc etc. I have seen sorcs use like 2 skills and kill fully geared people?
Can experienced Sorc pipe in here? The silence is annoying but gotta use your potions at the right time. Multiple silences well its happened to all of us.
Except that multiple silences on a sorc aren't "annoying" they are usually fatal. Unlike a melee class, if slienced, you won't deal significant damage- if silenced, as a sorc, you have to run it off (if buried), and if you are lucky, you can get a GS proc off off your auto-attacks.

And killing people that are fully geared with just 2 attacks? really? again, sure that can happen if you get a lucky GS proc if using the right damage GS, combined with DP, but really, otherwise that isn't going to happen.

Finally, most sins are just going to run off WA, once in a while it's great to get a lucky sin who'll reflect himself to death- but most will run it off and come back when it's on CD- and it does have a long CD.

Last edited by Coira - Israphel; 12-24-2015 at 03:38 PM.
  #5  
Old 12-24-2015, 05:01 PM
Asmodians
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  • Posts: 257
Default Re: PVP Help vs Well-geared Arena of Disc

Arena and open world are totally different right. Nowhere to run as a sin in the arena circle.

Take a look at some of the sorc videos. Some of the Korean videos are insane...sorcs taking out groups of 3-4 people (not sure their gear).

Balaur seeker and Glacial shard do a crap ton of damage even against fulled enchanted geared players. My sin gets hit for between 4-7k from sorcs with 1 spell.
  #6  
Old 12-24-2015, 05:02 PM
Asmodians
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Default Re: PVP Help vs Well-geared Arena of Disc

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=FTLvLT9nlAM
  #7  
Old 12-24-2015, 05:07 PM
Asmodians
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Default Re: PVP Help vs Well-geared Arena of Disc

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Gutt2XyEJqk

There were 2 hit kills in this video. The other players barely moved.
Curse of roots, delayed, silence, balaur seeker, glacial shard etc etc.
  #8  
Old 12-24-2015, 05:22 PM
Asmodians
  • Rank: Israphel’s Adjutant
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Default Re: PVP Help vs Well-geared Arena of Disc

Quote:
Originally Posted by Jalapeno - Israphel View Post
vs SM: even yet tough match, usually can win; easily win if socket curse of weakness.
I'm still laughing at this. Not at you Jalapeño, but the SM who would do this....


Edit: No Instagib love?
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Last edited by Forthyn - Siel; 12-24-2015 at 05:27 PM.
  #9  
Old 12-24-2015, 11:49 PM
Asmodians
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  • Posts: 241
Default Re: PVP Help vs Well-geared Arena of Disc

Yes, multiple silences (or any buried silence) is usually fatal for a sorc because we have no tanking ability without being able to cast shields. We are left with potion, antishock scroll, strafing (if not rooted), or trying to run away/behind a corner.

Pvp videos are not helpful outside of the arena. I can run around Levinshore killing people working on BM gear too in 3s and 4s. In the arena, if you have been playing it for a while, you are matched against someone with a similar win/loss ratio as you, who may or may not have similar gear as you. I am often matched with these great generals and generals and I stand no chance against them. Socketing pve nukes like glacial shard or flame spray over a stun or sleep is not usually an option (perhaps others' playstyles allow full nukes to go into the pvp build? I use all pvp stigmas). No doubt, having some pve nukes would help me against the classes I feel weak against (overgeared glads and less so templars) because I can't take them out in one rotation when they can take me out immediately when out of cc in a few hits.

I agree that sins are screwed in that boar arena sometimes too because there is nowhere to hide and get away. I hate the boar arena other than the fact I can siphon life from the boar.

Anyhow rotations against glads and other sorcs are what I'm interested in first, followed by perhaps help vs rangers:

vs glads:
I usually blind leap or illusion and do somnolence first (1 sec charge) followed by tree, but other times I lead with a stun or try to bury a silence/root. I won't bother with stuns if I see unwavering devotion up, and I have learned to not bother with roots or snares if I see strengthen wings up, both of which tend to go up after the first rotation and I get my face smashed in because you can't sleep them long enough (or I dotted them and screwed up). Damage rotation once they are silence rooted is delayed, magma burst, balaur seeker (now called aetherflame!) unless I get them caught with remove shock on cd and no UD up (in which case I can arcane thunderbolt, damage, whirlwind, damage, etc.). One thing I see other sorcs do is cast other skills into aether's hold--they don't spam aether flame and end with magic fist. I don't understand why you would waste your other skills during that time unless you have pve nukes socketed as you then have nothing left when both aether's hold and nukes are on cd. I'm thinking I need to illusion before the cleave chain, but that only helps for the first one and it is on a short 18 sec cd. The rest of them you get to eat silence and knockdown since illusion is on a long 2 min cd.

vs other sorcs:
you can lead with somn, silence, arcane thunderbolt. I don't have a protocol because it is what isn't on cooldown that is used. I find that I often lose because these "good sorcs" can hold somn down longer than me due to ping and get a 2-cast off rather than a 1-cast off. What would be helpful here is if someone could say "sleep lands at the same time as x so cast x when they cast sleep" or something to that extent. Like in 2.7, it was tree each other, plain sleep lands at the same time as sleep storm (go figure), and then go from there. Now with somnolence and absolute zero/freeze (whatever it is called now, not to be confused with the new skill 'freeze' that replaced frostbite for asmos since we have to have the same skill names as Elyos now), I find the sorc vs sorc battle to have more variables that it isn't as robotic fighting each other.

Do yall ever use thick shield for anything? If so, what?

Do yall use the ground targeted aoe delay skill ('mounting explosion')? How do you fit it in? Do you use meteorite at all? How do you fit it in?

Do you prefer slumberswept wind or repulsion field? I find both are extremely slow on the application and have lost to a pve hero using the pve vision stigma who just stood there and cast nukes at me after winning the somn battle for silence bury. He was one of those who can take you out in 2-3 shots as this sin said and do so repeatedly.

Do yall use different sets of gear for different classes or is it pretty much we're stuck running mboost/hp?

What do you find the best uses of absolute zero/freeze are? I try to use it as an extra cc when my cc's are on cd since it lasts just as long, but I don't know how to open out of it really because if you mistime, the skills are resisted.

Heck, I'm at a loss on how to open on these overgeared glads from a tree/sleep: ice chain, flame fusion/flame cage, silence/root or just root, depending on how desperate I get, try to nuke, and all I got on nukes are delayed/aetherflame or delayed, fire chain. Maybe I could use some tutoring on my nuke rotation? I usually play cc specs so don't have any pve nukes socketed unless it's a free for all like a siege or something where cc doesn't matter.

Last edited by Jalapeno - Israphel; 12-24-2015 at 11:51 PM.
  #10  
Old 01-29-2016, 02:01 AM
Elyos
  • Rank: Soldier
  • Posts: 4
Default Re: PVP Help vs Well-geared Arena of Disc

Maybe you can videotape some of your fights and the pro Sorc's can give better advice. You do point out alot of valid issues of Sorcs, but I think they can be overcome with better gear or "smoother" gameplay.

From your posts I guess you have neither Flame Spray nor Storm Strike. If you can't kill the average enemy in one rotation then you should definitely take one of them with you. Usually a geared Sorc would just silence+root a Glad and then double delay + Flame Spray + Balaur Seeker and then spam Flamebolt chain + 3 wind spears + whatever they have and the Glad should be dead. Even if they are geared you can just BOIC and kill them anyway, and after they lose their UD/SW they just die over and over.
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