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  #11  
Old 03-14-2015, 05:09 PM
Elyos
  • Rank: Commander
  • Posts: 686
Default Re: Is Crafting Useful Yet?

Crafted items are still insanely good. For weapons for sure, armor, not so much since there's no set bonuses with the crafted sets (if they made crafted armor with set bonuses it MIGHT be worth a shot but they would still likely be way too expensive).

Compare these two. First is the EB dagger, second is the crafted Legendary noble katalium dagger. Katalium is much better but an absolute nightmare to craft (if you got one from the event, you're lucky).

http://aiondatabase.net/us/item/100201393/

http://aiondatabase.net/us/item/100201466/
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  #12  
Old 03-15-2015, 08:37 AM
Elyos
  • Rank: Commander
  • Posts: 774
Default Re: Is Crafting Useful Yet?

Quote:
Originally Posted by Avrae - Israphel View Post
"Is Crafting useful yet?"

Short answer: No. Alch can make you a bit of money, but the time wasted here gathering/the act of crafting itself will yield a loss compared to just plain farming.

Long Rant:

The odds that anything will be done with the crafting system are slim to none. Aion is one of the few MMO's that essentially forces you to group to achieve anything noteworthy. Crafting is a solo activity. Everything in this game that results from solo activities typically sucks.

Double proc for 4 slots, triple proc for 6 slots.
I'm a 520P Master tailor. I have a Master Alchemist,Master Handicrafter, and Master Cook as well. I can say I've made substantial profit from Tailoring, however this is simply for skins. (The really annoying ones to make...) The gear out of tailoring fails to hold up on any level. Stats wise it's just rubbish when you compare it to instance and even coin gear. (Which is, by far, easier to obtain.) Take the Balic pvp crafted set, Triple proc (Or 4 proc if you want an extra .2% Lawl) It has no where near the stats of officer gear. In fact, it's barely a step above blood mark gear. The items needed to craft this set are foolish. (Seriously, you need crap that only drops out of instances? When they first were released none of those items were tradable either. Give me a break.) The only and I mean only crafted gear that's really worth anything are the weapons. And considering what it takes to create them they should be close to the best items in the game. But sadly this is not the case. So even the weapons, which can be a nightmare to craft, are still second rate.

I'm not saying make crafted stuff the best in the game. I'm saying make it comparable to the best stuff in the game. The crafting system is already painful enough, at least have some sort of worthy reward for it.

As for the too important line, it's not a matter of that. Crafting/Instance/PVP Gear should be running in parallels. Instead of how it is currently, where it's all spat out of EB and the crafting gear is just a joke with pretty skins.
Balic PvP cloth and leather can be equipped by chain (priests, AT) and plate (gladiator, templar) classes, which they have substantial magic suppression while having substantial PvP defense at the same time. All other level 60 and 65 PvP armor are class restricted. (for example, templars cannot equip blood mark or 65aug2 leather armor)
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Last edited by mooMOOMooMoomoo -; 03-15-2015 at 08:42 AM.
  #13  
Old 03-15-2015, 09:31 AM
Asmodians
  • Rank: Officer
  • Posts: 71
Default Re: Is Crafting Useful Yet?

Quote:
Originally Posted by Momomomoo - Israphel View Post
Balic PvP cloth and leather can be equipped by chain (priests, AT) and plate (gladiator, templar) classes, which they have substantial magic suppression while having substantial PvP defense at the same time. All other level 60 and 65 PvP armor are class restricted. (for example, templars cannot equip blood mark or 65aug2 leather armor)

Aware of this. You're talking about special circumstance sets. I've never met anyone who would take balic crafted over their class restricted pvp sets. Since most people opt for the cheaper AC/Arena gear to form an MSupp set that actually has an effective number against geared opponents. But I won't deny a small number in the populace does this, I assume you're one of them? As a Ranger myself looking at the crafted balic set and comparing it to 65Aug2. It doesn't hold up.

As for what you wrote in my quote "Double proc for 4 slots, triple proc for 6 slots" You lose a lot of stat if you don't proc that third run into Premium. Not to mention the 2 slots. I've sold a few premium non proc hats at skin price and I believe one Jerkin. Most other stuff spent a week or two in the broker before I finally just D/e'd it.

The fourth proc just doesn't seem to be worth the risk.
http://i61.tinypic.com/r1mrt4.jpg

Last edited by Avrae - Israphel; 03-15-2015 at 10:02 AM.
  #14  
Old 03-15-2015, 01:28 PM
Elyos
  • Rank: Commander
  • Posts: 774
Default Re: Is Crafting Useful Yet?

My master tailor character is a templar, with 6 slot balic leather pieces on chest and shoes, and a huge stockpile of balic materials. (Siel Elyos)

http://oi61.tinypic.com/eg1gf6.jpg

I'm thinking about getting an estate to mass craft it, then ditch the estate as soon as possible after all the materials are used up. But the last one on Siel Elyos sold for as high as 1.85 billion and I practically never get to be at home during the house auction time.

On the subject of estate crafting bonus, nobody had ever been able to give an answer on the following:

Quote:
Suppose Tiamaranta Award has a proc rate of 25%. Estate owners have a +5% chance to proc. Which one of the following statement is true?

a) 25% * 1.05 = 26.25%
b) 25% + 5% = 30%
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Last edited by mooMOOMooMoomoo -; 03-15-2015 at 01:32 PM.
  #15  
Old 03-15-2015, 01:31 PM
Asmodians
  • Rank: General
  • Posts: 190
Default Re: Is Crafting Useful Yet?

Quote:
Originally Posted by Avrae - Israphel View Post
Aware of this. You're talking about special circumstance sets. I've never met anyone who would take balic crafted over their class restricted pvp sets.
I guess you cannot know that for sure also, neither of us, since the chances to ever find buying a full crafted set is almost 0% Because crafters do not invest in them..
  #16  
Old 03-15-2015, 02:42 PM
Asmodians
  • Rank: Officer
  • Posts: 71
Default Re: Is Crafting Useful Yet?

It's Aion Mo, I'd lean towards "A". That being said, I've seen or heard nothing conclusive on the matter. Nothing that can't be explained by fair or foul runs of RNG. Depending on your timing or luck 25% can yield the same result, or worse, as 5%.

I've got thousands of skins and scales, 100's of many other items required and Zero Fire Fragments. Haven't seen any in the broker in 2 months. All of my mats will be passed to an alt to rot until the pve skins become valuable again. The set may work for you, but I wouldn't trade what I currently use for it.


@Lili
"I guess you cannot know that for sure also, neither of us, since the chances to ever find buying a full crafted set is almost 0% Because crafters do not invest in them.. "

Crafters don't invest in them because it is often a loss at the end. Hit a bad run of RNG and and your costs skyrocket rapidly. The prospective buyers are unlikely to eat an additional billion kinah on an item because you failed to proc 12 times. (It happens.) This is especially true when better gear is more readily available with a much smaller price tag.

Balic Leather Vs Officer Leather. It's really not Sophie's Choice.

Last edited by Avrae - Israphel; 03-15-2015 at 02:43 PM.
  #17  
Old 03-16-2015, 07:46 AM
Elyos
  • Rank: Vaizel’s Arrow
  • Posts: 5,570
Default Re: Is Crafting Useful Yet?

not really worth investing in crafting.

while NA had event with mythical katalium weapons we had on EU event with balic gear (ophidan) and i already have a few sets of cloth and leathers deposited on my alts in case i would play some of them.

event screwed up crafting... there should be events giving the raw materials not the final result.
  #18  
Old 03-17-2015, 07:25 AM
Asmodians
  • Rank: Commander
  • Posts: 698
Default Re: Is Crafting Useful Yet?

Quote:
Originally Posted by Avrae - Israphel View Post
Aware of this. You're talking about special circumstance sets. I've never met anyone who would take balic crafted over their class restricted pvp sets. Since most people opt for the cheaper AC/Arena gear to form an MSupp set that actually has an effective number against geared opponents. But I won't deny a small number in the populace does this, I assume you're one of them? As a Ranger myself looking at the crafted balic set and comparing it to 65Aug2. It doesn't hold up.

As for what you wrote in my quote "Double proc for 4 slots, triple proc for 6 slots" You lose a lot of stat if you don't proc that third run into Premium. Not to mention the 2 slots. I've sold a few premium non proc hats at skin price and I believe one Jerkin. Most other stuff spent a week or two in the broker before I finally just D/e'd it.

The fourth proc just doesn't seem to be worth the risk.
http://i61.tinypic.com/r1mrt4.jpg

I have 3 pieces of the balic pvp cloth set on my cleric, and later on I got an AC/Invasion cloth set to use as MS gear, out of curiosity I compared which of the two mitigated more magic damage (I only tested it swapping one piece: shoes, I should expand my test when I get time), and much to my surprise the AC cloth shoes mitigated more damage (when getting hit by my sorc) compared to my 6-slot proc balic shoes. Considering the cost of crafting balic gear that was quite a disappointment, it has more potential as an offensive MS set due to the 6-slots (and higher pvp def comapred to AC makes it more balanced in physical+magical scenarios), but it's defensively inferior when fighting pure magic damage.
  #19  
Old 03-17-2015, 05:09 PM
Elyos
  • Rank: Commander
  • Posts: 774
Default Re: Is Crafting Useful Yet?

Here's my theoretical calculations based on data gathered through in-game testing with all my available characters (level 65 templar and chanter, various lower level characters on other account) conducted under "laboratory conditions" (dual client dueling):

Attacker

Knowledge: 120
Skill damage (before knowledge): 1000
Magic Acc: 2100
Crit Spell: 140
PvP Attack: 33.5%

Defender

Class: Templar

Weapon: Remodeled Danuar Greatsword MS +50
Combine: Discordant Greatsword MS +50

Accessories: Discordant Combat (Blood Mark)

Armor sets: (unbuffed stats, but including passive 10% PvP defense)
1. Remodeled Danuar leather (Ancient Coin) filled with MS +50 ancient manastones
MS 2144, MR 1621, PvP Defense 15.4%, 28 open manastone slots
http://aion.aspirine.su/#!KgXHjNl

2. Fierce Skirmisher plate (Blood Mark) without MS stones
MS 968, MR 1653, PvP Defense 33.8%, 28 normal + 5 ancient open manastone slots
http://aion.aspirine.su/#!ttHDJed

3. Premium Braided Ophidan leather (Balic 4 slot non-proc)
MS 1738, MR 1488, PvP Defense 34.1%, 28 open manastone slots
http://aion.aspirine.su/#!RY8LCaZ

4. Noble Premium Braided Ophidan Leather (Balic 6 slot proc)
MS 1796, MR 1508, PvP Defense 34.6%, 38 open manastone slots
http://aion.aspirine.su/#!zZ4ZXK6

5. Seraph (2nd dan 65aug2)
MS 1288, MR 1756, PvP Defense 40.5%, 38 open manastone slots
http://aion.aspirine.su/#!uCC6ITA

6. Emissary (1st kyu 65aug2)
MS 1271, MR 1725, PvP Defense 39.3%, 38 open manastone slots
http://aion.aspirine.su/#!xIslVd9

7. Invasion Leather filled with MS +50 ancient manastones
MS 2644, MR 1621, PvP Defense 15.4%, 23 open manastone slots

Templar Magic Suppression armor damage calculation for PvP

Attacker MB 2000:
AC: Damage 581 / Crit 871
BM: Damage 912 / Crit 1368
Balic 4s: Damage 595 / Crit 892
Balic 6s: Damage 569 / Crit 853
2 dan: Damage 729 / Crit 1093
1 kyu: Damage 745 / Crit 1117
Invasion: Damage 581 / Crit 871

Attacker MB 2500:
AC: Damage 753 / Crit 1129
BM: Damage 1116 / Crit 1674
Balic 4s: Damage 799 / Crit 1198
Balic 6s: Damage 772 / Crit 1158
2 dan: Damage 920 / Crit 1380
1 kyu: Damage 938 / Crit 1407
Invasion: Damage 581 / Crit 871

Attacker MB 3000:
AC: Damage 995 / Crit 1492
BM: Damage 1321 / Crit 1981
Balic 4s: Damage 1003 / Crit 1504
Balic 6s: Damage 975 / Crit 1462
2 dan: Damage 1110 / Crit 1665
1 kyu: Damage 1131 / Crit 1696
Invasion: Damage 753 / Crit 1129

Attacker MB 3500:
AC: Damage 1238 / Crit 1857
BM: Damage 1526 / Crit 2289
Balic 4s: Damage 1207 / Crit 1810
Balic 6s: Damage 1177 / Crit 1765
2 dan: Damage 1301 / Crit 1951
1 kyu: Damage 1324 / Crit 1986
Invasion: Damage 995/ Crit 1492

Attacker MB 4000:
AC: Damage 1480 / Crit 2220
BM: Damage 1676 / Crit 2514
Balic 4s: Damage 1411 / Crit 2116
Balic 6s: Damage 1380 / Crit 2070
2 dan: Damage 1492 / Crit 2238
1 kyu: Damage 1518 / Crit 2277
Invasion: Damage 1238 / Crit 1857

================================================== ======

Calculations:

Step 1: Calculate net Magic Boost
Net MB = Magic Boost - Magic Suppression
(Minimum 0, Maximum 2900)

Step 2: Apply net MB
Step2 = floor(Skill Damage * (Knowledge + Net MB / 10) / 100)

Step 3: Apply magical defense
Step3 = Step2 - floor(Magic Defense / 10)

Step 4: Apply elemental resistance
Step4 = floor(Step3 * (1 - Elemental Resistance / 1300))

Step 5: Apply PvP Attack, PvP Defense, and 42% global PvP modifier
FinalDamage = floor(Step4 * (1 + PvP Attack - PvP Defense) * 0.42)

Update: Corrected PvP Attack/Defense calculation, added 6 slot Balic leather, changed headgear for 4 slot Balic

Update 2: Removed extra round down before applying 42% PvP damage reduction
__________________
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See your EXP numbers (4 most significant digits)
Now supporting 5.6! (2.4.3 - 2017-07-24)
https://github.com/maxperiod/aiongrindmeter2

Last edited by mooMOOMooMoomoo -; 03-21-2015 at 07:01 PM.
  #20  
Old 03-18-2015, 04:35 PM
Asmodians
  • Rank: Banned
  • Posts: 467
Default Re: Is Crafting Useful Yet?

Long story short, no.
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